tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21496941.post2040969445233766553..comments2024-02-08T13:16:43.153+05:00Comments on THE DHIVEHISTAN REPORT: The Preservation of the Qur'anAdam Moseshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08995795280423083892noreply@blogger.comBlogger29125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21496941.post-23013568863910457512013-06-09T18:11:51.010+05:002013-06-09T18:11:51.010+05:00Excellent ѕіte yοu have hеre but I waѕ wondering
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I suppose for now i'll settle fοr <br />booκ-mагking аnd аdding your RЅS <br />feed tο my Googlе account. I look fоrωaгd tο <br />fгesh updаtes and ωill share <br />thiѕ blog with my Faсebook gгoup.<br />Сhat ѕoon!<br /><i>My web-site</i> ; <b><a href="http://Leehanxue.com/cloud_wiki/tiki-index.php?page=UserPagebryanphel" rel="nofollow">http://leehanxue.com/cloud_wiki/tiki-index.php?page=UserPagebryanphel</a></b>Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21496941.post-17217349044708078792011-09-21T16:05:00.794+05:002011-09-21T16:05:00.794+05:00surely there's a place in hell ready for you :...surely there's a place in hell ready for you :) many of what you have wrote is wrongAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21496941.post-92069903812791242902009-01-12T02:29:00.000+05:002009-01-12T02:29:00.000+05:00Are Surah 1, Surah 113, and Surah 114 supposed to ...Are Surah 1, Surah 113, and Surah 114 supposed to be part of the Qur'an? Ibn Masud (Muhammad's top choice as a teacher of the Qur'an) says no. Zaid says yes. Who's right? Have a guess, Abdullah?<BR/>(though my money's on the man Muhammad believed was more reliable; feel free to go against your prophet on this one, though).<BR/><BR/>Are Ibn Ka'b's two additional Surahs supposed to be part of the Qur'an? Ibn Ka'b (Muhammad's top choice as a reciter of the Qur'an) says yes. Zaid says no. Who's right? Have a guess, Abdullah?<BR/><BR/>According to Aisha and Ibn Ka'b, two-thirds of Surah 33 is missing. Were these missing verses supposed to be part of the Qur'an? Have a guess, Abdullah?<BR/><BR/>According to Aisha, after she wrote down the Verse of Stoning and the Verse of Suckling and laid them under her pillow, a goat ate them. The Verse of Stoning and the Verse of Suckling aren't part of the Qur'an today. Were they supposed to be? Have a guess, Abdullah?<BR/><BR/>According to Sahih Muslim, the early Muslims used to recite entire Surahs that they later forgot. Were these Surahs supposed to be part of the Qur'an? Have a guess, Abdullah?<BR/><BR/>Ibn Umar told Muslims that they shouldn't say that they have learned all of the Qur'an, since much of it is missing. Were these missing parts supposed to be part of the Qur'an? Have a guess, Abdullah?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21496941.post-41887121687092651182009-01-12T02:20:00.000+05:002009-01-12T02:20:00.000+05:00Abdullah,According to Sahih Bukhari, Muhammad's ch...Abdullah,<BR/>According to Sahih Bukhari, Muhammad's chosen teachers were four:<BR/><BR/>Narrated Masriq: 'Abdullah bin 'Amr mentioned 'Abdullah bin Masud and said, "I shall ever love that man, for I heard the Prophet saying, 'Take (learn) the Qur'an from four: 'Abdullah bin Masud, Salim, Mu'adh and Ubai bin Ka'b.' "<BR/>- Sahih Al-Bukhari, Book 61<BR/><BR/><BR/>First among Muhammad's chosen teachers of the Qur'an was ibn Masud. Yet Ibn Masud is well known to have disagreed with Zaid's text of the Qur'an. The disagreements were not limited to qirrat or minor word variations, but even the number of surahs was not something they agreed on! Ibn Masud, Muhammad's preferred teacher of the Qur'an, did not include al-Faatihah, al-Falaq, or al-Naas in his text! Ibn Masud's text contained only 111 surahs. About Zaid's text (the modern Qur'an), Ibn Masud is reported to have said the following:<BR/><BR/>The people have been guilty of deceit in the reading of the Quran. I like it better to read according to the recitation of him (Muhammad) whom I love more than that of Zaid Ibn Thabit. By Him besides Whom there is no god! I learnt more than seventy surahs from the lips of the Apostle of Allah while Zaid was still a youth, having two locks and playing with the youth.<BR/>- Kitab al-Tabaqat al-Kabir, vol. 2, p.444<BR/><BR/><BR/>To settle this dispute between Zaid and ibn Masud, why not turn to someone else who Muhammad chose as an excellent teacher of the Qur'an? One of the other four Muhammad hand-picked was Ubay bin Ka'b. But when we turn to Ubay, we find out that he disagreed with both Zaid and ibn Masud, and he included 116 chapters in his Qur'an! However, we do find agreement between his text and ibn Masud's text against Zaid's text (such as the ordering of the surahs) and between his text and ibn Abbas's text (such as verses that Zaid did not include). Beyond this, we find in Ubay's Qur'an verses that Umar considered part of the Qur'an (the Verses of Rajm, or Stoning) which Zaid left out, much to Umar's chagrin.<BR/><BR/>So what of the modern text of the Qur'an? Without having to make any conclusion myself, I can simply recount the data and say the following:<BR/><BR/>- Muhammad's chosen teachers disagreed with it<BR/>- They disagreed with the number of chapters<BR/>- They disagreed with the order of the chapters<BR/>- They disagreed with the content of the verses<BR/>- Even Umar agreed with Muhammad's teachers against Zaid's Qur'an<BR/><BR/>The evidence is strong, and the conclusions are overwhelming. It seems that those who gloss over these facts or deny them will remain Quranically confused.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21496941.post-45802814059342636322009-01-11T23:23:00.000+05:002009-01-11T23:23:00.000+05:00Anonymous,not when every single one of them repeat...Anonymous,<BR/>not when every single one of them repeats the same thing..over and over...whats there to question about?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21496941.post-34251828180134034142009-01-11T22:14:00.000+05:002009-01-11T22:14:00.000+05:00abdullah,why cannot not memory of thousands be not...abdullah,<BR/>why cannot not memory of thousands be not questioned?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21496941.post-29249862246614439782009-01-11T22:13:00.000+05:002009-01-11T22:13:00.000+05:00"I think the teachers of Islam are to blame if a c..."I think the teachers of Islam are to blame if a counter argument is not available to us. "<BR/><BR/>Maybe there is no counter argument that makes any sense?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21496941.post-20938461750957147372009-01-11T08:55:00.000+05:002009-01-11T08:55:00.000+05:00Anonymous,Yes individual memory can be questioned ...Anonymous,<BR/>Yes individual memory can be questioned not memory of thousands.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21496941.post-89539492619921201012009-01-10T13:37:00.000+05:002009-01-10T13:37:00.000+05:00Aisha (Mohamed's child bride with whom he had pedo...Aisha (Mohamed's child bride with whom he had pedophile sex) said that the Koran verse dealing with stoning to death existed. It was written down on a parchment and she kept somewhere in the house. Meanwhile in the upheaval following Mohamed's death she got busy and a goat found the parchment and ate it. <BR/><BR/>Sources: Musnad Ahmad bin Hanbal. vol. 6. p. 269. Sunan Ibn Majah, p. 626. Ibn Qutbah, Tawil Mukhtalafi 'l-Hadith<BR/><BR/>Allah must have used goats to edit the Koran!ދިވެހި ކްރިސްޜިއަންhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03633263875345852023noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21496941.post-28121004022010362912009-01-10T12:23:00.000+05:002009-01-10T12:23:00.000+05:00@abdullah. it's an argument, agreed. but how logic...@abdullah. it's an argument, agreed. but how logical and convincing is it. You surely know how unrealiable human memory is. Simple memory tests with even those gifted to have good memory will show that over time it deteriorates.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21496941.post-5544312314588617832009-01-09T21:03:00.000+05:002009-01-09T21:03:00.000+05:00again copy pasting from Jews. the question is have...again copy pasting from Jews. the question is have you read it before copy pasting. You would question Quran which is believed to be source of inspiration for a civilization that dominated the earth for 13 centuries but you would not question some website run by Jews who are the most deceitful of all people.<BR/><BR/>"We find Aisha and Ubayy ibn Ka'b reporting that more than a hundred verses of Surah 33 are missing."<BR/>above claim is based on a fabricated saying. Devout Christians Jews are jealous that so many of the muslims have learned the quran by heart. And at the time of prophet there were thousands of reciters of the quran who recite the quran from their memory. yes there are seven readings of the quran there is no difference there it is of different dialects of arabic.<BR/>you think you are so bright that these allegations have not been answered by the scholars of Muslims time and time again..<BR/>reead<BR/>http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/Text/Qiraat/hafs.html#3Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21496941.post-63299696024162841492009-01-09T05:21:00.000+05:002009-01-09T05:21:00.000+05:00@fiz. you comment about diacritical errors, and th...@fiz. you comment about diacritical errors, and those arguments in the article does raise some valid questions about why a higher Being chose a language that clearly does not communicate the message He/She wanted to communicate to the human race. Why doesn't he use telepathy or something? I really wonder why he left us with all this inconvience. Test us? Nah, I think they's just watching this human soap opera and having a good laugh!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21496941.post-74547494879033351802009-01-09T01:13:00.000+05:002009-01-09T01:13:00.000+05:00While viewing mvblogs.org, if the beginnings of th...While viewing mvblogs.org, if the beginnings of the first sentence do not make much sense, just check the author. It's bound to be arabiguitar. //Ignored SuccesfullyAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21496941.post-42768344646248978552009-01-08T22:47:00.000+05:002009-01-08T22:47:00.000+05:00Dude, why do you even bother with this?People of f...Dude, why do you even bother with this?<BR/><BR/>People of faith will simply disregard things like this simply as a "blasphemous smear campaign by some heretic bastard". Nothing else would matter, not hard to imagine why. I mean we are so used to choosing sides with obscurity in the face of historicity, fact or even logic. I'll bet most of the guys who blew tantrums here didn't even bother reading, let alone contemplating the implications of such a claim.<BR/><BR/>My stance in this, personally, is that I don't really know enough on the subject to conclusively decide. But one thing I am not going to do is ignore the sound of reason and knowledge that I have. <BR/><BR/>For me, this whole point of this is just baseless. To begin with, the literal accuracy doesn't really matter... I mean 1400 years after the scripture was revealed, we still kill each other just because we interpret it differently. Oh, by the way, here is something that you didn't mention. The original Koran did not have diacritics and this was added a few centuries after Muhammad passed away. The nature of the Arabic language is that diacritical errors cause words to loose their meaning. This alone creates a colossal amount of misinterpretation and we are not even considering the dubious methods of compilation described by scholars.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21496941.post-51253852207254128622009-01-08T15:43:00.000+05:002009-01-08T15:43:00.000+05:00i am the guy who said " i am the first guy who wil...i am the guy who said " i am the first guy who will stand with sword to kill u"<BR/><BR/>My name is albaany<BR/><BR/>to contact me u can email to albaany@walla.comAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21496941.post-63923423651327822092009-01-08T15:21:00.000+05:002009-01-08T15:21:00.000+05:00first try to understand quran.. without knowing an...first try to understand quran.. without knowing any thing ur writing ..Southern football clubhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08314302325005605269noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21496941.post-53449422702058566402009-01-08T15:13:00.000+05:002009-01-08T15:13:00.000+05:00Thank you for this interesting piece. Your argumen...Thank you for this interesting piece. Your arguments are logical and an honest appraisal of the available evidence. Being no expert on this, I wait for a good counter-argument from the opposing view. <BR/><BR/>I am dismayed by my Muslim brothers/sisters for the lack of common decency in their reaction. Asking someone to go hell or another country maybe alright. Blaming someone’s lack of understanding of Quran and Islam solely on his/her mother is grossly unfair. I think the teachers of Islam are to blame if a counter argument is not available to us. And threatening to kill the author only hints at the innate frustration of not being able to address the issue here.<BR/><BR/>May Allah bless us all!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21496941.post-46679695405588947702009-01-08T13:16:00.000+05:002009-01-08T13:16:00.000+05:00Muslims become personally upset when you show them...Muslims become personally upset when you show them that Koran has errors....they dont argue the points..they identify themselves so much with Islam when you question it, it is like questioning their parentage...<BR/>Their prophet Mohamed steals personal identities as well..and replaces it with Islam...<BR/>the language is stolen, culture is stolen and theIR sounds are also stolen..<BR/>IN THE END THEY JUST BECOME ZOMBIES OF ISLAMAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21496941.post-36185521890696482962009-01-08T13:05:00.000+05:002009-01-08T13:05:00.000+05:00and the "the first guy who will stand with sword t...and the "the first guy who will stand with sword to kill" me is also anonymous!!<BR/>Declare yourself you Muslim coward!Dhivehi Resistancehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03072666887343006601noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21496941.post-10734460350645786412009-01-08T12:56:00.000+05:002009-01-08T12:56:00.000+05:00BTW..did any of you read it before you wrote your ...BTW..did any of you read it before you wrote your comments?Dhivehi Resistancehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03072666887343006601noreply@blogger.com